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> Date sent:      Mon, 9 Dec 1996 10:36:22 -0500
> Send reply to:  "CELTIC-L - The Celtic Culture List." <[log in to unmask]>
> From:           Tom McClive <[log in to unmask]>
> Subject:        Re: Black Irish
> To:             [log in to unmask]

> On Mon, 9 Dec 1996, Ellen Rudd wrote:
>
> > I don't know about the Normans.  The Vikings (Danes) were red-haired,
> > and the traditional protrait of an Irish lass with flaming hair may
> > indicate she has genes from the Viking pool.  Between the early Celts,
> > the Romans, (anyone know about the coloring of the Normans?), and the
> > Spaniards, it seems likely to me that to be dark is more "Irish" than to
> > be red-haired if you want to go all the way back to about 200 BC when
> > the first Celts made their way to Ireland.
>
> the majority of the people in scandanavia are from the northern germanic
> branch, except the lapps that still live in the extreme north who are
> anybody's guess but have some mongoloid features, i believe.

Maybe the little dark pre IE europeans we're looking for? Maybe Bjork
is part lap, explaining her eyes (she's got no eskimo in her, just in
case anyone was thinking that)!

  swedish,
> norwegian, and danish are northern germanic languages and are related to
> the anglo, saxon, and jute that formed old english.  finish is not
> indo-european but is related to languages in the ural mountains.
>
> as i understand it, the normans were scandinavians who came to france and
> adopted much of the local culture, including the language (old french, at

Yep - Vikings that were given Normandy ("Norman" = "North Man" ie
Viking) in exchange for not sacking Paris



> that point), but still remembered their roots.  william the conqueror was
> related to harold, king of england.  when harold was crowned, william, who
> was also an early contender for the throne, was outraged and so decided to
> cross the channel and change history.
>
> so, to try to answer the question in a roundabout way, the coloring of the
> normans would be in line with the coloring of all the northern germans.
>
> i, too, have heard that the "black irish" are supposed to be from the
> spanish sailors who washed ashore after the defeat of the spanish armada.
>

Yes, but its rubbish

>
> tom mcclive
>