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Stefan:

Attenuator is ok with me. The problem still is we are trying to  
communicate with people that have acitvely chosen to ignore Stafford's  
work under the excuse that it is too hard to understand. But still,  
the WORLD is in a mess.

For those who have not yet been notified my "Law & Cybernetics" video  
can be seen at:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hgqGJfsYnzE

I am positively certain that it answers a lot of questions that never  
got an answer in Law School.

Best regards,

Javier Livas


On May 6, 2009, at 1:51 AM, Stefan Wasilewski wrote:

> OK. It's not the word filter, but what it can be seen to mean.  
> Stafford uses 'attenuator' and 'filter', plus I've seen 'rectifier'  
> used by others, my point being the application of these words. In  
> the VSM it is attenuator whereas in the text filter is used as a  
> result of actions.
>
> To me the act of attenuation results in the filtering of a signal or  
> range of actions. Attenuation is an active thing that along with its  
> counter-part amplification involves the second-order stuff at each  
> communication channel. Whilst I'm struggling to catch up with my  
> math the concepts of signal processing, state space and homeostasis  
> are still quite clear, the conversation across the whole of the VSM  
> is in the channels between at least two matrices of variety. As long  
> as the meta-state can govern the lower-state actively they are both  
> up to the task.
>
> The problem comes when humans are involved with differing variety  
> state-spaces at different areas of the channels. It's like putting  
> the wrong value resistor/diode in differing spots when the circuit  
> diagram says they should all be the same.
>
> I suppose my question is really attenuator or filter then. I prefer  
> the former because it differentiates from the result from its actions.
>
> Best regards
>
> Stefan
>
> On 6 May 2009, at 07:09, Javier Livas wrote:
>
>> Stefan:
>>
>> The point is that filter gives the exact idea versus amplifier. All  
>> the VSM literature is built this way. Maybe there is a need for a  
>> rectifier, but not in this context, I think.
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>> Javier Livas
>>
>> On May 6, 2009, at 12:43 AM, Stefan Wasilewski wrote:
>>
>>> Most people seem to forget that this is a dynamic, a yin-yang  
>>> symbol spinning with its seed seemingly growing and dying. The  
>>> context is a large planet with lots of micro-boundaries, the  
>>> problem is which point to feedback and how. I mentioned to Javier  
>>> that he uses 'filter' but intuitively 'rectifier' is better for me  
>>> because it means the person doing the 'rectification' has filtered  
>>> first and then acts upon it with authority.
>>>
>>> On 5 May 2009, at 23:19, Nick Green wrote:
>>>
>>>> Thinking about it further (and having just re-run Javier's  
>>>> excellent video) it's probably a matter of computing good values  
>>>> for capability and potential, in VSM terms- and , as Javier says,  
>>>> directing the negative feedback to the right place.
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: Stefan Wasilewski
>>>> To: [log in to unmask]
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 10:45 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: Stafford and Catastrophe Theory
>>>>
>>>> Will do, let you know!
>>>>
>>>> On 5 May 2009, at 22:35, Nick Green wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> The maths is pretty clear, except for one or two lines. In  
>>>>> general there's probably not much to learn here but in your  
>>>>> case, financial, it may well be possible to unambiguously  
>>>>> identify a Collapsing Factor (CF) and an Implicated Factor (IF).  
>>>>> For the financial crisis we might say American House prices and  
>>>>> Liquidity. But basically it's surely unwillingness to invest  
>>>>> because of the secretiveness about risk -which would be a  
>>>>> different model....Hmmm. Now I've got a headache.. Suggest you  
>>>>> let yourself off the hook a little by reading the last paragraph  
>>>>> first!
>>>>>
>>>>> Best
>>>>>
>>>>> N.
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: Stefan Wasilewski
>>>>> To: [log in to unmask]
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 9:25 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: Stafford and Catastrophe Theory
>>>>>
>>>>> Now you've given me a headache!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 5 May 2009, at 20:44, Nick Green wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> http://www.iiasa.ac.at/Admin/PUB/Documents/RM-75-016.pdf
>>>>>
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