Thanks Barry,

It seems to me that two approaches to mechanisms that sift / evaluate / analyze etc. are:

1)  Strong Artificial Intelligence with genetic programming and smart robot avatars cruising the web, etc. or

2)  Filters that are probability tuned to each person in the population of users - eg as Stafford described a matrix of everyone mapped against everyone else with each designating a desirability/probability of receiving messages from another and information is shared in the whole group according to the overall probability settings. So if I have Roger set at 100, I will receive all of Roger's posts, if I change that number to 50, I receive on average one out of every two of his posts.   One cannot assign zero probability to anything as this prevents learning and the information is distributed redundantly across the whole population.  An aspect of Redundancy of Potential Command.

In our Metaphorum case, at present our matrix would have all cells at 100 percent thanks to the Listserv.  As we grow we will be unable to keep this up and by then maybe we will have a way to filter our incomings, as part of a population where the information is not lost to the group just because there is no capacity to receive it.

Both of these schemes would benefit from TS architecture.

All the best for the season to all of you and yours.

Joe


From: BARRY A CLEMSON <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
Sent: Tuesday, December 23, 2008 5:36:50 PM
Subject: Re: Where the web is taking us

Joe,

I think you are absolutely right about the potential for Team Syntegrity. How we get there is of course the question. In the meantime, I expect to see some attempts to develop web-based mechanisms to sift thru / evaluate / analyze opinions and produce some "validated" ideas.

Barry

Barry
On Dec 23, 2008, at 6:06 PM, Joseph Truss wrote:

Thanks Barry,
 
It sounds like another call for a design of a web-based platform for participatory democracy.  

Team Syntegrity architecture is still unparalleled for designing variety engineered spaces.  Imagine a 'world forum space' where Statements of Importance are posted within a fully collaborative social network navigation space that is a fractal icosahedron, that is each emerging topic that comes out of a plexus of players forms a virtual syntegration, and each syntegration topic could spin off its own syntegration.  

The whole system is interconnected to the various levels of recursion of citizen, syntegration, pollsters, industry, think-tanks, up to the highest governance level who are receiving not 1,000 items from 30 voices but 12 focused statements useful to policy and decision making from each infoset.  

The navigation interface could be user selected to match their own context / metaphors, for instance the entire domain is the earth with major 'regions' and geographical subsets, or the domain is a country within which you can find different architectural structures, or the domain is my house and I can find objects that are familiar to me, my desk, workshop, kitchen cabinet, storage containers, etc - every level of recursion and its subsets represents the overall conversation content, syntegration plexuses, topic categories, and so on.

I suggested in an earlier post a Metaphorum project proposal to design the 'participatory democracy' platform as above and embed it in its place in a VSM model as a way to explain the concepts of viability and further to get funding from any agency, foundation, university, etc.  that is interested in participative, democratic methods and technologies that enrich and maintain the feedback  loops between 'governance for the people' and 'governance by the people'.

Allenna, Chris and I met Tad Homer-Dixon  (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Homer-Dixon) and 3 years ago we talked about an initiative he was considering when he was at University of Toronto to develop an open source software based problem solving process / technology.  Tad has since published his latest book 'the Upside of Down' and is now at University of Waterloo.  We haven't communicated since about the UofT initiative. 

I think there is a high probability that there will be available funding somewhere for something like what I'm proposing,  but it would take a big effort on all of our parts to focus on this one idea and develop a convincing proposal.

I appreciate that there have been a number of appeals, including yours, to get some critical mass around a common project.  If Nick's proposal to Google is accepted I imagine that might be the focus and that would be fine.

We do know that this is where the web is taking us - where will we take the web?

Best regards,

Joe



From: BARRY A CLEMSON <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
Sent: Tuesday, December 23, 2008 9:05:11 AM
Subject: Where the web is taking us

There is an excellent article in Salon on where the web is taking us and the sort of tools needed to move from a web of free-floating opinion to a web of reasoned discourse and useful conclusions.

http://www.salon.com/tech/feature/2008/12/23/david_brin_google/?source=newsletter

Barry
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BARRY A CLEMSON
[log in to unmask]

757-692-6673

Cybernetica Press at www.cyberneticapress.com



"It's not how much you do - it's how much love you put in it.... Do small things with great love."
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===================================================

BARRY A CLEMSON

757-692-6673

Cybernetica Press at www.cyberneticapress.com



"It's not how much you do - it's how much love you put in it.... Do small things with great love."
            --- Mother Teresa ---

The true warrior may be killed, but he can not be defeated. 
   --- my paraphrase of Sensei Hamada ---

And peace rolled down like a mighty river.
       -- Inspired by the prophet Amos 5:24--


"An enemy is a person whose story we have not heard."
           -- Gene Knudsen Hoffman --

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ For more information go to: www.metaphorum.org For the Metaphorum Collaborative Working Environment (MCWE) go to: www.platformforchange.org METAPHORUM eList Archive available at - https://listserv.heanet.ie/ucd-staffordbeer.html Archive of CYBCOM eList available at - http://hermes.circ.gwu.edu/archives/cybcom.html ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


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