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On 4/4/05 11:50, "Neil McLeod" <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> Micheál wrote:
> 
>>> (a) Maar (n-)eólus úaidh féin
>>> (b) fios na n-ôg ∂s na naos
>>> (c) go naoi ∂s ó naoi anûas
>>> (d) mûr do fhaoi gac[h] áo[i]s
>>> (e) uaidh do€gheabh do grés
>>> (f) fer gACH b(h)ûain re bao[i]s.
> 
>> I still can't see the MS, so using the "crossword method" only, any
>> chance that expansion in line (f) could be for "gAN" rather than
>> "gACH" (especially as we have the earlier symbol for "gach" just two
>> lines above?  This man so unlike myself......
> 
> There is no formal reason why 'g + suspension stroke' couldn't stand for
> 'gan'. So it is certainly worth considering.
> 
> (My recollection is that 'gan', and earlier 'cen', (without) are not
> usually abbreviated in this way, whereas 'gach' sometimes is. But
> recollection is a treacherous thing. If my recollection is being loyal
> this time, I suspect the problem with abbreviating 'gan/cen' (without)
> is that it might lead to confusion with its opposite: 'gu/co' (with).)
> 
> How would you read this line with 'gan' in the context of the whole
> poem? Presumably line (f) would have to flow on from line (e).
> 
> Neil
> 
"One unconnected to foolishness" as subject of do-gheabh in line (e) with
line (d) as the direct object and material above as the indirect object
referred to by "uaidh".  That with only "what if" methodology an attempt to
provide a final line to Dennis' previous translation of a-e.  (At the moment
I haven't yet had time to read your work since then.)

Although my brain was working backwards from modern usage, there are some
exx. in DIL under buain, (d) "With meaning completed by following prep....."
I'd take the Four Masters one (with "le" rather than "re") "aga mbeith buain
nó báidh le Saxancoibh" 'connexion or alliance' and Céitinn's Three Shafts
an Bháis one "ní fhuil buain ag briathraibh Sh. ria" 'do not refer to'.

Also late but...not never.

And now I see you ask the first question "in the context of the whole poem"
rather than the preceding lines only.  Aha! That must be why I opted out of
the examination system all those years ago!



Micheál