LISTSERV mailing list manager LISTSERV 16.5

Help for CELTIC-L Archives


CELTIC-L Archives

CELTIC-L Archives


CELTIC-L@LISTSERV.HEANET.IE


View:

Message:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Topic:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Author:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

Font:

Proportional Font

LISTSERV Archives

LISTSERV Archives

CELTIC-L Home

CELTIC-L Home

CELTIC-L  February 1999

CELTIC-L February 1999

Subject:

Re: Welsh annexion, was Re: Knights of Tir Na Nog

From:

Neil McEwan <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Neil McEwan <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Wed, 17 Feb 1999 00:27:31 -0400

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (85 lines)

At 12:37 AM 2/17/99 +0100, Mag.phil. Raimund Karl wrote:

>Neil McEwan wrote:

>>    And sometimes they're quite right to do so.  Look how much hay has been
>> made by politicians out of the Holocaust -- but they're still justified in
>> saying that history proves anti-Semitism to be a bad thing.
>
>No, they are not. History prooves not in the slightest that
>anti-Semitism is a bad thing, it only prooves that a certain form of
>anti-Semitism resulted in the loss of millions of lives of innocent
>people of mosaic faith - the judgment if this is good or bad is simply
>outside the discipline of history - as it is a moral judgement, not a
>scientific theory.


   And how is that moral judgement arrived at?  People don't just wake up
in the morning and say, "This is wrong".  They say, "this is wrong because
it has resulted in such-and-such in the past".


>It's the same as if one would say that physics
>prooves that gravity is a bad thing as things that fall to the floor
>usually get damaged.


   False analogy -- history deals with human actions which are within the
scope of moral consideration -- physics does not.


>[...]
>While I, personally, do also think that the Holocaust was a very bad
>thing, I can't agree that history prooves that anti-semitism was a bad
>thing, and even less that politicians are justified in claiming that
>history prooves that anti-Semitism is a bad thing, because, in doing
>this, they do the same thing the Nazis did with history - they give
>their interpretation a pseudo-scientific cover which looks bright, safe
>and shining - as this has been prooved by some science, so there's no
>need to discuss it any more, no necessity to think about it


   And yet if we refuse to draw the lesson from history, how else will we
arrive at the conclusion that anti-Semitism is wrong?  From "a priori"
principles that leave the fundamental questions unanswered?


>>    This is a bit like saying that because people have been known to choke
>> to death on food, we'd all be better off not eating.
>
>It would be nice if it were that easy, and I can only recommend reading
>Popper's Open society and it's enemies to you.


    I am familiar with Herr Popper, but nowhere do I remember his advocating
that we throw the baby out with the bathwater.


>> The German-speaking
>> peoples seem to have an continuous sense of an impending Fourth Reich
lurking
>> around the corner of everything and that is understandable, but it is not
>> really worth taking seriously for most of us.
>>
>Well, half of the western world has nothing better to do to tell the
>Germans (and the Austrians as well, by the way) every second day how
>evil they were and how anti-Semitic they still are, so this is somewhat
>a national trauma over here.


    Yep and I don't agree with it at all -- it's beating a dead horse and
it damn well ought to stop.  However the historical trauma works somewhat
similarly in the non-German West: over here, practically every influential
political idea is labelled "fascist" or "Nazi" by the people who disagree
with it; it's a kind of automatic hyperbole that has degraded the language.
 Now, I hear Germans (online, or in the media) do this sort of thing a lot
too, and although they do it for a nobler reason (usually motivated by
genuine concern, rather than the desire to score quick and easy points)
it is no more realistic on their part.  The Nazis, in my opinion, were a
historical one-off; and if they ever come again, it won't be from a tiny
little country like Wales.


Neil
--

Top of Message | Previous Page | Permalink

Advanced Options


Options

Log In

Log In

Get Password

Get Password


Search Archives

Search Archives


Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Subscribe or Unsubscribe


Archives

January 2019
December 2018
September 2018
March 2018
January 2018
December 2017
March 2017
February 2017
January 2017
November 2016
August 2016
May 2016
April 2016
March 2016
February 2016
January 2016
December 2015
November 2015
October 2015
September 2015
July 2015
June 2015
May 2015
March 2015
February 2015
December 2014
November 2014
October 2014
August 2014
June 2014
May 2014
February 2014
October 2013
September 2013
August 2013
July 2013
June 2013
May 2013
April 2013
March 2013
January 2013
December 2012
November 2012
October 2012
September 2012
August 2012
July 2012
June 2012
May 2012
April 2012
March 2012
February 2012
January 2012
December 2011
November 2011
October 2011
September 2011
August 2011
July 2011
June 2011
May 2011
April 2011
March 2011
February 2011
January 2011
December 2010
November 2010
October 2010
September 2010
August 2010
July 2010
June 2010
May 2010
March 2010
February 2010
January 2010
December 2009
November 2009
October 2009
September 2009
August 2009
July 2009
June 2009
May 2009
April 2009
March 2009
February 2009
January 2009
December 2008
November 2008
October 2008
September 2008
August 2008
July 2008
June 2008
May 2008
April 2008
March 2008
February 2008
January 2008
December 2007
November 2007
October 2007
September 2007
August 2007
July 2007
June 2007
May 2007
April 2007
March 2007
February 2007
January 2007
December 2006
November 2006
October 2006
September 2006
August 2006
July 2006
June 2006
May 2006
April 2006
March 2006
February 2006
January 2006
December 2005
November 2005
October 2005
September 2005
August 2005
July 2005
June 2005
May 2005
April 2005
March 2005
February 2005
January 2005
December 2004
November 2004
October 2004
September 2004
August 2004
July 2004
June 2004
May 2004
April 2004
March 2004
February 2004
January 2004
December 2003
November 2003
October 2003
September 2003
August 2003
July 2003
June 2003
May 2003
April 2003
March 2003
February 2003
January 2003
December 2002
November 2002
October 2002
September 2002
August 2002
July 2002
June 2002
May 2002
April 2002
March 2002
February 2002
January 2002
December 2001
November 2001
October 2001
September 2001
August 2001
July 2001
June 2001
May 2001
April 2001
March 2001
February 2001
January 2001
December 2000
November 2000
October 2000
September 2000
August 2000
July 2000
June 2000
May 2000
April 2000
March 2000
February 2000
January 2000
December 1999
November 1999
October 1999
September 1999
August 1999
July 1999
June 1999
May 1999
April 1999
March 1999
February 1999
January 1999
December 1998
November 1998
October 1998
September 1998
August 1998
July 1998
June 1998
May 1998
April 1998
March 1998
February 1998
January 1998
December 1997
November 1997
October 1997
September 1997
August 1997
July 1997
June 1997
May 1997
April 1997
March 1997
February 1997
January 1997
December 1996
November 1996
October 1996
September 1996
August 1996
July 1996
June 1996
May 1996
April 1996
March 1996
February 1996
January 1996
December 1995
November 1995
October 1995
September 1995
August 1995
July 1995
June 1995
May 1995
April 1995
March 1995
February 1995
January 1995
December 1994
November 1994
October 1994
September 1994
August 1994
July 1994
June 1994
May 1994
April 1994
March 1994
February 1994
January 1994
December 1993
November 1993
October 1993
September 1993
August 1993
July 1993
June 1993
May 1993
April 1993
March 1993
February 1993
January 1993
December 1992
November 1992
October 1992
September 1992
August 1992
July 1992
June 1992
May 1992
April 1992
March 1992
February 1992
January 1992
December 1991
November 1991
October 1991
September 1991
August 1991
July 1991
June 1991
May 1991

ATOM RSS1 RSS2



LISTSERV.HEANET.IE

Secured by F-Secure Anti-Virus CataList Email List Search Powered by the LISTSERV Email List Manager