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SEANCHAS-L  December 2010

SEANCHAS-L December 2010

Subject:

Re: crom [was: Re: [SEANCHAS-L] Star map]

From:

Richard Marsh <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

List for Scholars and Students of Gaelic Folk Traditions <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Sat, 11 Dec 2010 22:02:34 -0000

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (62 lines)

To clarify --
>This subject came up on the Old Irish list in June 2002. The results of
my
>on-site investigations were not taken seriously by that list ...

It was a result of a discussion of the meaning of Crom Crúaich. Some
insisted the Killycluggin Stone was phallic and compared it to the Lia Fáil
on the Hill of Tara. They don't look at all alike, as you can see in the
photos.
http://www.legendarytours.com/tara.html
http://www.richardmarsh.ie/killycluggin.htm

Unfortunately, I don't have a photo of the hay ricks in the fields of Cavan,
but they are the same size and shape as the Killycluggin Stone. Art
borrowing from life rather than the other way round, I would think.

Helen reckoned --
"Oh and there may be an overlap here with Crom and Pathalon as the
leader of the first or second invasion of Ireland ..."

I don't perceive any relationship between them. Fanciful though it may be, I
prefer this theory about Partholon. It's a chapter + note in my book Spanish
and Basque Legends:

How the Basques Discovered Ireland

Paraphrased and quoted from The New Chronicles of England and France by
Robert Fabyan, 1516.

Moliuncius was the first king of Britain. Belynus and Brennius were his
sons. Gurguncius, son of Belynus, became king of Britain in 356 BC. The
Danes had been withholding an agreed tribute, and Gurguncius mounted an
expedition to Denmark to give the Danes a reason to reinstate payments.
Having whipped them into submission, Gurguncius was on his way back to
Britain, when he encountered a fleet of 30 ships full of men and women
beside the Orkney Isles. The chief Captain, Bartholomew, told the king that
they were Basques exiled from Spain and had been sailing a long time in
search of some prince who would give them a dwelling place, and they would
become his subjects and hold the land of him. Bartholomew beseeched the king
to have compassion on them and grant them a place to inhabit, so they need
not continue to live on their ships.
“The king with the advice of his barons granted unto them a void and vast
country, which was and is the farthest isle of all isles toward the west,
the which isle as sayeth the English Chronicle was then named Ireland ...”

Note

According to Irish mythological history in the medieval Lebor Gabála Érenn,
the first people to arrive in Ireland were led by Cessair, granddaughter of
Noah. They were killed by the Deluge forty days after they arrived. Ireland
was empty for 278 years until the Partholonians arrived from “Greece”.
Rudolf Thurneysen (Zeitschrift für celtische Philologie, 13) believed that
the name of the leader of these first successful residents, “Partholón”, was
a corruption of “Bartholomew”. If this is so, and if Fabyan’s account has
any basis of truth (and ignoring the date given), then the first Irish
people may have been Basques.
The Lebor Gabála is available in Spanish: Leabhar Ghabhála: El libro de las
invasiones, Ramón Sainero Sánchez, ed., Ediciones Akal, Madrid, 1988.

Richard Marsh
Dublin

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