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UCD-STAFFORDBEER  October 2009

UCD-STAFFORDBEER October 2009

Subject:

Re: Utilities - : Stuff, Life & Cybernetics

From:

Javier Livas <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Forum dedicated to the work of Stafford Beer <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Tue, 6 Oct 2009 08:54:07 -0500

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (311 lines)

Angela:

In the final version of my script for Stuff... I erased a suggestion  
that I thought should have more space or become another video in its  
own right. The idea is in your text below. I just focus a bit more.

I suggest that WE, the metaphorum create a STANDARD for labeling  
products and industries according to their contribution to  
sustainability. The reason is this: once people or consumers become  
aware of the classification of the product they are buying it will be  
much easier to favor sustainability. This is in my view creating a  
SYSTEM 2 that prevents oscilation and channels people towards creating  
a NEW ATTRACTOR at a societal level. People will start copying each  
other as sustainability becomes some sort of fad. As we know, optimal  
regulation is always in the SYSTEM 2 because it is self-imposed.  
Countries should be labeled too. In this scheme of things I would  
probably give Nuclear energy a coloor BLACK category, the worst, not  
because of the incipient danger of the operation, but simply because  
of the nature of the trash that they produce. I have started a project  
to do that classification, but what I have until now is not much. So I  
won't contaminate the group with half baked ideas.

Regards,

Javier Livas


On Oct 6, 2009, at 6:16 AM, Angela Espinosa wrote:

> Mark and Doug
> What Javier makes clear in his video and what Mark presents as  
> evidence is what has been concerning me for a while: there isn't any  
> reliable mechanism for accountability on corporate (or national)  
> social responsibility, or effective (cybernetically sound) measures  
> of sustainability/non sustainability at most national or  
> international levels. As we have only recently evolved into a global  
> society and had to face global issues (i.e. climate change, peak  
> oil, inequality etc) we keep dealing these issues at the wrong level  
> of recursion; governments are free to do or not do things regarding  
> their eco-responsibility and there is no real problem if we do not  
> enough. Most governments get distracted in hundreds of  
> sustainability indicators that are finally not used for making  
> decisions; as a consequence, decisions are made blindly or following  
> other pressures.
> As Doug correctly points us, there isn't a System 3/4 proper  
> resolution on a grand scale; even more; there isn't a proper  
> homeostat designed at that level. We need to start with lower levels  
> to make sure this consciousness and environmentally friendly  
> responses happen at all levels. But the issue is at Mark indicates  
> that we need to start by covering the other 90% of the USA utilities  
> companies (for example) with proper measurements systems and tools  
> to make sure we are all seriously aligned and positevely acting in  
> reducing CO2 and converting our industries into greener industries.  
> This is going to go very likely against the Status Quo so will  
> generate resistance from those enjoying the benefits of the current  
> situation. But is possible - see for example the example from R.  
> Anderson (USA) who shows that with proper criteria you can transform  
> industries; there are interesting examples of governments who have  
> achieved serious progress at this level; we need to learn from them  
> on how can we transform governments to create the right sort of  
> institutions/mechanisms for sustainable governance.
> Angela
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Forum dedicated to the work of Stafford Beer on behalf of Doug  
> McDavid
> Sent: Tue 10/6/2009 11:34
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Utilities - : Stuff, Life & Cybernetics
>
> This seems like a Systems 3 & 4 tension on a grand scale.  Is the  
> problem
> the inefectiveness of any System 5 on the requisite scale?
>
> On Tue, Oct 6, 2009 at 3:14 AM, mark van clieaf
> <[log in to unmask]>wrote:
>
>> Angela
>> I will forward some analysis we are doing on the USA utility industry
>> in analyzing the proxy statements of 30 of the largest utilities  
>> who are
>> major GHG emitters
>>
>> The key point is when you review what the Named Officers are held
>> accountable for,
>> measured on and paid for, 90 % of the 30 Utilities are rewarding  
>> for STATUS
>> QUO,
>> short-term earnings and dividends on an old electric utility model.
>>
>> ONLY 10 % of the companies have specific metrics, targets, and  
>> executive
>> pay
>> aligned and disclosed to shareholders related to
>>
>> . Reducing GHG emissions
>> . Increasing energy efficiency with customers
>> . Innovating with renewable energy in changing the generation  
>> portfolio
>> . Innovating with smart grid and distributed energy systems
>>
>> And the global pension funds - many which are government pension  
>> funds,
>> and Signatories to the UN Principles of Responsible Investment
>> are continuing to vote their proxy for this - Business As Usual.
>>
>> Thus we are getting what the system is designed to do - Staus Quo.
>>
>> We also got what the financial services sector was design to do.
>> Short term profits, with high risk and leverage that was NOT  
>> sustainable
>> finance.
>>
>> We get what we measure, we get what we manage and we for sure
>> get what we pay for - all part of the systems design.
>>
>> Best Regards
>>
>> Mark Van Clieaf
>>
>>
>> On Oct 6, 2009, at 5:52 AM, Angela Espinosa wrote:
>>
>> Dear Javier
>> Many thanks for your excellent video.
>> As you may know, I have been participating in a n EPSRC funded  
>> project,
>> called 'Emerging Sustainability'. Our intention was to create an
>> experimental web portal to facilitate development of communities of  
>> practice
>> in issues of sustainability, seen from systemic and complexity  
>> perspectives.
>> We have only recently launched the portal; it's an open source type  
>> of
>> portal, and we are inviting people like you to contribute there and  
>> to share
>> knowledge/ questions/ information  etc in innovative ways to deal  
>> with
>> sustainability. I have seen before the Story of stuff and have  
>> posted it in
>> the front page of the portal, as I consider it is a very powerful  
>> and clear
>> message on what's going on. Your cybernetic version of it is very  
>> good and
>> useful : it is exactly the sort of reflection that I was hoping to  
>> invite to
>> and you have done a very good start. Please have a look at the  
>> place, I've
>> invited you and posted a comment about your video there.
>> I also want to invite any of the Listserve member who may be  
>> interested in
>> contributing there to end me an email at [log in to unmask] and  
>> I'll
>> send you invitations to join it.
>> The link is:
>> http://emergingsustainability.org/index
>> Angela
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Forum dedicated to the work of Stafford Beer on behalf of  
>> Javier
>> Livas
>> Sent: Tue 10/6/2009 05:07
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Stuff, Life & Cybernetics
>>
>> Dear All:
>>
>> Just added another video to the collection on YOUTUBE.
>>
>> Stuff, Life & Cybernetics
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmDh1SJKGA4
>>
>> Just added another video to the collection. Hope you like it and pass
>> it around.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Javier Livas
>>
>>
>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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>>
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>>
>>
>> ______________________________________________________
>> Mark Van Clieaf
>> Managing Director
>> MVC Associates International
>> Consultants in Organization Design, Leadership & Shareholder Value
>> Tampa . Houston . Toronto .  London
>> www.mvcinternational.com
>> North America Mobile - 905-330-9607
>> Tampa - 813-600-5259
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>>
>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ For  
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>
>
>
>
> -- 
>
> Doug McDavid
> [log in to unmask]
> 916-549-4600
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> For more information go to: www.metaphorum.org
>
> For the Metaphorum Collaborative Working Environment (MCWE) go to:  www.platformforchange.org
>
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>
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> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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>
>
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> For more information go to: www.metaphorum.org
>
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>
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>
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> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> *****************************************************************************************
> To view the terms under which this email is distributed, please go  
> to http://www.hull.ac.uk/legal/email_disclaimer.html
> *****************************************************************************************
>
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> For more information go to: www.metaphorum.org
>
> For the Metaphorum Collaborative Working Environment (MCWE) go to:  www.platformforchange.org
>
> METAPHORUM eList Archive available at - https://listserv.heanet.ie/ucd-staffordbeer.html
>
> Archive of CYBCOM eList available at - http://hermes.circ.gwu.edu/archives/cybcom.html
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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For the Metaphorum Collaborative Working Environment (MCWE) go to:  www.platformforchange.org

METAPHORUM eList Archive available at - https://listserv.heanet.ie/ucd-staffordbeer.html

Archive of CYBCOM eList available at - http://hermes.circ.gwu.edu/archives/cybcom.html
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