On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 08:51:35 +0200, David Stifter scríbas:
>52. "Bîaid dano in tsesêrgid Suidi 19) Chaim .i. isre atas tormus
>dobêrai 20) scêla derbai in toóchaidhe. Môet[h]aighfid cride 21)
>dûrai arnaisdeis na ndemno 7 inna n-ifernda 22) re ocht .xx." 23) "Is
>trôcar", or Bricîn.
>19) E: teiséirgid S*uidi
>20) E: asre atus tormas dobera
>21) E: cridiu
>22) E: arnaisdes na ndemno 7 inna n-iffernda
>23) mbl. add. E
This passage was difficult and I'm not completely satisfied with my
“Biaid dano ind eséirge Suidi Chaim .i. isre atas tormus do·béra scéla
derba in todóchaidi. Maethaigfid cride dúra arind aisndís na ndemno ocus
inna n-ifernd re ocht fichtib mblíadnae.” “Is trócar,” or Bricín.
“Then there will be the resurrection of the Seat of Cam (the Crooked
Seat?), that is, isre atas tormus?? He will bring sure tidings of the
future. He will soften hard hearts against the explanation of devils and
of hell before (for?) 160 years. “It is a mercy,” said Bricín.
I thought ‘in tsesêrgid’ was possibly the nominative singular article
plus ‘es(s)éirge’ (“re-arising, resurrection”), the verbal noun
of ‘as·éirig’. DIL gives it as an io stem neuter (later feminine) noun.
There is a verb ‘eséirgid’ (arises) but we need a noun here. The neuter
article should be ‘a’ and the feminine article should be ‘ind’ before a
vowel and ‘int’ before ‘s’. But I couldn’t find a suitable word that
started with an ‘s’. I am not happy with my interpretation of this word.
I could not find ‘Suidi Chaim’ in the onomasticon.
‘Suidi’ looks like the genitive singular of the io stem
neuter ‘suide’ (“act of sitting, sitting down...extended
meanings...bishopric.....seat”). ‘Chaim’ looks like a genitive form and
could either be a person’s name the adjective ‘cam(m)’ (crooked). There
is a lenition on the ‘c’ because lenition follows “genitive singular of
neuter o- and io- stems”(Thurneysen p. 143.)
The phrase ‘isre atas tormus’ doesn’t look like Irish to me, and it
doesn’t look like Latin either. I couldn’t find these words in the Latin
dictionary, but I found the entire first sentence of this passage quoted
in DIL A 442.25 in a short entry for ‘atastormus’ and the phrase is
tentatively translated “the period when it was decided?”. Aside from ‘re’
which could translate “a space, interval..generally of time” I couldn’t
figure out how the dictionary editor came to that translation. I
suppose ‘atastormus’ could be a relative verb form, or the modern relative
particle ‘a’ plus a relative verb form. But I couldn’t identify a verb
that would fit, and I really tried.
I thought ‘dobêrai’ was the 3rd singular future of do-beir (gives,
brings), which I normalized to ‘do·béra’ after the paradigms on Strachan
p. 80. ‘Scêla’ looks like the accusative plural of ‘scél’ (story,
narration, tale...news, tidings...information, account,
statement..”. ‘Derbai’ looks like the accusative plural of the o, a stem
adjective ‘derb’ (“sure, certain, fixed, determinate”) which I normalized
to ‘derba’ after the paradigms on Strachan p. 17.
The two ‘o’s in ‘toóchaidhe’ look strange to me, but the word
immediately reminded me of Modern Irish ‘todhchaí’ (future). I found an
Old Irish adjective ‘todochaide’ which is used as an io stem neuter
substantive, translating as “future time”. DIL gives a few examples that
are spelled with a fada on the second ‘o’. I would expect a genitive
singular of ‘todóchaidi’.
I thought ‘Môet[h]aighfid’ was the 3rd singular future
of ‘maethaigid’ (“softens, mitigates...of breaking up and fertilizing
soil”). I thought ‘cride’ was the accusative plural of ‘cride’ (heart),
an io stem neuter. And ‘dûrai’ looks like the accusative plural of ‘dúr’
(“hard, rigid, solid”).
Since it seemed to be followed by two genitive phrases, I
thought ‘arnaisdeis’ must contain a noun. I thought the most likely
candidate was “aisnéis Old Irish aisndís..n stem feminine...verbal noun of
as-indet....act of relating, telling, explaining; narration,
explanation...legal act of giving information, informing against.” This
is Modern Irish 'faisnéis'. I wasn’t sure how best to translate the word
I didn’t see ‘maethaigid’ used with ‘ar’ in the dictionary.
I thought ‘arnaisdeis’ contained the preposition ‘ar’ with the
meaning (DIL A 368.73) “With verbs of protecting, saving ‘from’,
defending ‘against’”. One of the examples is “ar demnaib”.
I thought the ‘n’ of ‘arnaisdeis’ indicated the singular article.
According to the paradigm on Strachan p. 14 and Thurneysen p. 209
nominative,dative, and accusative singular forms of nasal stems can be
identical. DIL gives ‘aisndeis’(dot over n) as one of the nominative
singular forms, but most of the dative and accusative forms in the
dictionary end in ‘-dís’(with or without a dot over the ‘n’) so I used
The phrase ‘na ndemno 7 inna n-ifernda’ looked like two genitives to
me. The masculine substantive ‘demon’ has a genitive plural of ‘demna’
cited in DIL D (2d fascicle) 22.15. The genitive plural of the masculine
article is given as ‘inna n-, na n-’ in Strachan. It seems strange to see
two different forms of the genitive plural article in the same sentence.
The phrase ‘inna n-ifernda’ looks like the genitive plural article plus a
form of ‘ifern,ifrenn’ (hell), an o stem masculine. I would expect a
genitive plural of ‘ifern’ or ‘ifrenn’. I saw some variants
spelled ‘iffirnn..iffeirnn..iffurnn’ in DIL so I could understand the ‘-nd-
’ substitution for ‘-nn’ but I could not understand or explain the
ending ‘-a’ so I chopped it off the word in the normalization. According
to DIL I 55.5 the word is used in the plural, but it’s not usually used in
the plural in English so I just translated it as singular ‘hell’.
I added ‘mblíadnae’ (genitive plural) from source E because I thought
it made more sense than just the raw number 160. Liz Gabay