LISTSERV mailing list manager LISTSERV 16.5

Help for IRTRAD-L Archives


IRTRAD-L Archives

IRTRAD-L Archives


IRTRAD-L@LISTSERV.HEANET.IE


View:

Message:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Topic:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Author:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

Font:

Proportional Font

LISTSERV Archives

LISTSERV Archives

IRTRAD-L Home

IRTRAD-L Home

IRTRAD-L  December 2004

IRTRAD-L December 2004

Subject:

Pah humbug !!!

From:

Jim Carroll <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Irish Traditional Music List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Wed, 22 Dec 2004 19:00:13 -0000

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (137 lines)

Larry and all,
Please don't get me wrong - I have no objection to anybody celebrating
Christmas, Walpurgis Night, Passover, Diwali or whichever ceremony suits
their particular belief - I just don't believe Irtrad is a place to offer
prayers (no matter how insipid). Irish music is now being played and enjoyed
by people of many faiths, and as far as I am concerned, long may that
continue to be the case.
While it is true that Ireland is a religious nation, (in theory anyway);
sadly, it is also the case that religion had torn this country apart in an
extremely bloody manner - certainly over the last thirty odd years.
As a non-believer, I have long ceased to attempt to understand Christian
ethics. It was a little over twelve months ago when a mob of locals here in
Miltown Malbay, who, I would guess, describe themselves as good Christians,
drove out into the worst of winter weather, a sick man and his mainly young
family who had been made homeless by a fire in their caravan - this to the
accompaniment of a chant of 'Travellers out'. This is not because of
anything the family had done, rather because of what they were - Travellers.
These events got the support of a 'well respected' list member who still
wishes to remain nameless.  It is ironic to think that if Johnny Doran were
alive today he or his family would not be able to get a drink in a pub in
this 'home of traditional Irish music'.
Surely, if politics is a banned subject on Irtrad on the basis that it might
frighten the horses, the same must apply to a subject as divisive as
religion.
However, if Zuki's (somewhat syrupy, for my taste) piece is deemed
acceptable, I would offer another - not, I hasten to add, written by me, but
by a good friend, exactly half a century ago, give or take a few days.  The
ending has been changed as the aspirations of the eponymous hero of the song
is as far from being realised as it ever was.

The Ballad of the Carpenter (Ewan MacColl - 1954)

Jesus was a working man, a hero you shall hear;
Born in the slums of Bethlehem at the turning of the year,
At the turning of the year

When Jesus was a little boy the streets rang with his name,
For he argued with the aldermen and he put them all to shame.
He put them all to shame.

His father, he apprenticed him a carpenter to be,
To plane and drill and work with skill in the town of Galilee,
In the town of Galilee.

He became a roving journeyman and he wandered far and wide,
And he saw how wealth and poverty were always side by side.

So he said, "Now all you working men, you farmers and weavers too,
If you will only organise, the world belongs to you".

So the fishermen sent two delegates and the farmers and weavers too,
And they formed a working committee of twelve to see the struggle through.

When the rich men saw what the carpenter had done, to the Roman troops they
ran,
Saying, "Put this rebel Jesus down, he's a menace to god and man".

The commander of the occupying troops, he laughed and then he said,
"There's a cross to spare on Calvary Hill; by the week-end he'll be dead".

But Jesus walked among the poor, for the poor were his own kind,
And they wouldn't let the cops get near enough to take him from behind.

So they hired a man of the traitor's trade and a stool pigeon was he,
And he sold his brother to the butcher's men for a fistful of money.

When Jesus lay in the prison cell, they beat him and offered him bribes,
To desert the cause of his own poor folk and work for the rich man's tribe.

The sweat stood to upon his brow, the blood was in his eye,
When they nailed him to a Roman cross and laughed as they watched him die.

Two thousand years are past and gone, and many a hero too,
But the dream of that poor carpenter, it one day will come true.

I wish everybody my best wishes - that they may get a full share of the vast
wealth of this extremely rich planet - an opportunity to experience its many
beauties before these are destroyed by greed and thoughtless stupidity -
freedom from tyrants and despots, elected or self-appointed - and  a happy
and, above all, peaceful New Year.


-----Original Message-----
From: Irish Traditional Music List [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On
Behalf Of Larry Sanger
Sent: 21 December 2004 15:15
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Musicians' Christmas Prayer

Even though I am an agnostic (or atheist, depending on how you define the
terms), I support Bill.

Christmas is supposed to be a time of togetherness, friendship, and love.
This is an *Irish* music list; the Irish remain some of the most religious
of people in the West.  The Grinch and Scrooge are our favorite characters
of the season to hate.  And here are Jeff, Jim, and Tim taking Bill to task
for posting to IRTRAD-L a perfectly innocuous Christmas poem--for musicians!

You don't have to share Bill's faith--I don't--to appreciate innocuous,
heartfelt expressions of faith.

To take Bill to task for posting his "Musicians' Christmas Prayer" is the
sort of thing that, I think, makes us all less personal in our dealings with
each other, less willing to be seen as individualized, and less willing to
express our true (polite) feelings.  And--if this makes any sense--less apt
to burst into spontaneous song in public, as the Italians do.  Don't you
think the world is a much poorer place for that?  It seems to me this is the
sort of attitude that has made our brave new world tense and sanitized and
impersonal and passionless.

And just to reply in advance to something I know some will want to say: I
think obviously gratuitous expression of religious sentiment on the list
(e.g., posting the Lord's Prayer on June 15) would clearly be off-topic.
One might well run to teacher--or the list--about that.  But on an Irish
music list, four days before Christmas, a "Musicians' Christmas Prayer" by a
well-respected list member is decidedly *not* off-topic.  There's a
difference!

Ya grinches.  :-)

--Larry



--
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.296 / Virus Database: 265.5.4 - Release Date: 15/12/2004




--
Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.296 / Virus Database: 265.5.4 - Release Date: 15/12/2004

Top of Message | Previous Page | Permalink

Advanced Options


Options

Log In

Log In

Get Password

Get Password


Search Archives

Search Archives


Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Subscribe or Unsubscribe


Archives

December 2018
October 2018
September 2018
June 2018
January 2018
September 2017
March 2017
February 2017
September 2016
July 2016
March 2016
February 2016
January 2016
December 2015
November 2015
October 2015
September 2015
August 2015
July 2015
June 2015
May 2015
April 2015
February 2015
January 2015
December 2014
November 2014
October 2014
September 2014
August 2014
July 2014
June 2014
May 2014
April 2014
March 2014
February 2014
January 2014
December 2013
November 2013
October 2013
September 2013
August 2013
July 2013
June 2013
May 2013
April 2013
March 2013
February 2013
January 2013
December 2012
November 2012
October 2012
September 2012
August 2012
July 2012
June 2012
May 2012
April 2012
March 2012
February 2012
January 2012
December 2011
November 2011
October 2011
September 2011
August 2011
July 2011
June 2011
May 2011
April 2011
March 2011
February 2011
January 2011
December 2010
November 2010
October 2010
September 2010
August 2010
July 2010
June 2010
May 2010
April 2010
March 2010
February 2010
January 2010
December 2009
November 2009
October 2009
September 2009
August 2009
July 2009
June 2009
May 2009
April 2009
March 2009
February 2009
January 2009
December 2008
November 2008
October 2008
September 2008
August 2008
July 2008
June 2008
May 2008
April 2008
March 2008
February 2008
January 2008
December 2007
November 2007
October 2007
September 2007
August 2007
July 2007
June 2007
May 2007
April 2007
March 2007
February 2007
January 2007
December 2006
November 2006
October 2006
September 2006
August 2006
July 2006
June 2006
May 2006
April 2006
March 2006
February 2006
January 2006
December 2005
November 2005
October 2005
September 2005
August 2005
July 2005
June 2005
May 2005
April 2005
March 2005
February 2005
January 2005
December 2004
November 2004
October 2004
September 2004
August 2004
July 2004
June 2004
May 2004
April 2004
March 2004
February 2004
January 2004
December 2003
November 2003
October 2003
September 2003
August 2003
July 2003
June 2003
May 2003
April 2003
March 2003
February 2003
January 2003
December 2002
November 2002
October 2002
September 2002
August 2002
July 2002
June 2002
May 2002
April 2002
March 2002
February 2002
January 2002
December 2001
November 2001
October 2001
September 2001
August 2001
July 2001
June 2001
May 2001
April 2001
March 2001
February 2001
January 2001
December 2000
November 2000
October 2000
September 2000
August 2000
July 2000
June 2000
May 2000
April 2000
March 2000
February 2000
January 2000
December 1999
November 1999
October 1999
September 1999
August 1999
July 1999
June 1999
May 1999
April 1999
March 1999
February 1999
January 1999
December 1998
November 1998
October 1998
September 1998
August 1998
July 1998
June 1998
May 1998
April 1998
March 1998
February 1998
January 1998
December 1997
November 1997
October 1997
September 1997
August 1997
July 1997
June 1997
May 1997
April 1997
March 1997
February 1997
January 1997
December 1996
November 1996
October 1996
September 1996
August 1996
July 1996
June 1996
May 1996
April 1996
March 1996
February 1996
January 1996
December 1995
November 1995
October 1995
September 1995
August 1995
July 1995
June 1995
May 1995
April 1995
March 1995
February 1995
January 1995
December 1994
November 1994
October 1994
September 1994
August 1994
July 1994
June 1994
May 1994
April 1994
March 1994
February 1994
January 1994
November 1993
October 1993
September 1993
August 1993
July 1993
June 1993
May 1993
April 1993
March 1993
February 1993
December 1992

ATOM RSS1 RSS2



LISTSERV.HEANET.IE

Secured by F-Secure Anti-Virus CataList Email List Search Powered by the LISTSERV Email List Manager