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Subject: Re: word question
From: Fiona Patrick <[log in to unmask]>
Reply-To:Scottish Gaelic Language beginners forum <[log in to unmask]>
Date:Thu, 4 Sep 2003 09:21:51 +0100
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a good question, Niall.   a lot of folk have pondered this question .. i
mean the number f anglicisations that are creeping in.
so here's my tuppence .. well fourpence worth:
one guilty party, i know, is/was the the radio. If broadcasters didn't know
what the Gaelic [or the newly created Gaelic for a particular word or
expression] was then, for the sake of expedience, they just gaelicised an
English one.
Also, i, personally, suspect it is the sheer speed with which people are
learning Gaelic in proportion to the number of native speakers who are
actually using it on a daily basis to bring up their families, in the
community, in the pub, at work, etc.  I think that is the greatest influence
on the language - from us, the learners, who, even in Scotland, are usually
learning in a vacuum without the benefit of absorbing the language in the
normal way - ie from the family & community around them and when stuck for a
word they've no-one to ask. Children too, gaelicise a lot of english words
simply because there are far more english and american programs on the telly
+ they're surrounded by english-speaking playmates.  Children learn more
language from each other than they do from their parents.
+ All languages do change over time. I sometimes think i never hear any of
the Scots that i was surrounded by as a child, [that change was a deliberate
educational and media one to get rid of the 'common' Scots tongue!]  and
Gaelic is changing too.  It has to as well - its just that the changes seem
to be in super-drive. + lots of expressions simply become obsolete with the
changing pattern of life.

as to 'national'.   i personally, can't recall hearing 'dłthchail' used in
that sense.  Maybe some of the others can.  perhaps too there's a shade f
difference n the meaning.  'dłthaich' is the land, the country as opposed to
'nation' being a total community of people regardless of creed or culture
who are taken to belong to one country.

Dwelly lists 'nąisein' [boir] - old inhabitants of a country.  So perhaps
even 100 years ago an anglicism ,or pehaps more correctly a Latinism, had
crept in or, perhaps it is a Gaelic wrd which stems from a common cognate
with 'nation'.

there is the word 'duthchasach' which might be more appropriate.  but i
suspect it has more to do with being hereditary as in the
'original/hereditary people of the community'."Nuair a thrčigeas na
dłthchasach Ile, beannachd le sith Albainn" ... 'When the natives forsake
Islay, farewell to the peace of Scotland'.
On the other hand, pehaps "Tha mi air seachran mar a' chaora sa Bhioball"
[i'm completely off the mark] as my friend and old teacher said to me when i
was making a mess of understanding 'chuir do litir drol me' :-))

It'll be interesting to hear what other list-members have to say. We're
fortunate to have members on our list with a phenominal knowledge of Gaelic.

ehm!  looks like my fourpence worth has become sixpence worth - and in
English too  :-(  sorry.  my pen is inclined to run away with itself.

le dłrachd
Fionnghal
...........................

Subject: word question


Why isn't dłthchail ever used for "national" in Gaelic signs and instead
nąiseanta is always used? I've noticed this in "Ionad Nąiseanta na h-Imrich"
and
"Tearmann Nądair Nąiseanta". Is Dłthchail ever used anymore?

Does anyone have any idea about this trend to just use English words just
written according to Gaelic orthography? I wouldn't notice it if it was
something
brand-new, never seen by a Gael before. But little things that Gaels have
been writing about, nature, sports, everything, before the English words
even
existed, are getting replaced by them. It's odd.



Sląn mhath

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