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Subject: Re: I type therefore I am
From: Hrant H Papazian <[log in to unmask]>
Reply-To:Discussion of Type and Typographic Design <[log in to unmask]>
Date:Mon, 23 Dec 2002 00:18:16 -0800

text/plain (124 lines)

I previously wrote:
> [discussing the submissions] is not allowed

Although this was the case the previous year (which was probably
a reaction to a certain "judging situation" 2 years before that),
this is apparently *not* the case this year, I'm happy to see.

From:    Dave Nalle
> type samples ... are remarkably easy
> to distribute at relatively low cost

Yes, we haven't even talked about delivering
the entries remotely via PDF yet... (Sigh.)

From:    Matha
> certain people seem to be disqualified from expressing
> their opinions. I was under the impression that this
> was what Typo-L was for.

To be fair, Typo-L (like any "open" forum) is really way
too heterogenous to allow effective "blanketing" of its
members like that. There are some assholes, but even some
of those only appear that way because they in fact have
trouble communicating in a highly heterogenous community.
In fact Typo-L is the least abrasive type list I know of.
So try to give more benefit of the doubt: it won't change
the psyche of grown adults, but it's more constructive in
terms of community.

From:    Jef Tombeur
> What do jurys decide of?

Good question.
I think it depends mostly on the goals of the organization
in question, with the jury being chosen accordingly. So the
resultant jury could be ideologically neutral, or it could be
skewed in some way. For example, Morisawa has a strong calli-
graphic skew (look at the results over the years), while the
TDC has a slight American skew. I think if an organization
really believes in some ideology, then it should assemble a
jury that is likely to fit that mold, but even so it should
not try to steer the jurors once the ball is rolling.

From:    Jill Bell
> Why just pick on the TDC?

Because it's current? Because I think there's benefit in
doing so? Because it makes claims (like being international)
that need to be looked at more closely? Because James made
a post to Typo-L about it, and then Dave made a retort that
triggered me in turn? Because unlike Bukvaraz, Linotype and
Morisawa they charge for entry? Many entirely valid reasons.

> It seems you are primarily pissed off because
> TDC (and many others) make, spend and cost money.

Not at all.
As I keep saying, I am pissed off because they seem
to favor shmoozing over the discovery and promotion
of typographic talent, over cultural enrichment.

> Where do you draw the line between who gets
> paid for their effort and who doesn't?

Good question. Let's talk about it.

> any conference or event pays it's speakers,
> or pays their airfare or hotel?

ATypI didn't for Rome, and it was the best conference
in a generation. Money is not the soul of humanity.

> many of TDC's judges also present a program to the club

And you see that as an *obligation*?!

> Shipping a show may be less money but it would still cost money.

Then ship it!

> it wouldn't work for all types of contests.

Who cares? We're talking about type contests here. It's not
like we can solve the world's problems. Let's focus, and on
Typo-L specifically, let's focus on type.

> I suspect that if money got tight for them, they
> could and would ship the type design entires.

?! To maintain the high fees, I guess?
The money is tight right now for *type designers*,
the people who in fact make the competition what
it is, what it *could be*.

> designers in Argentina or elsewhere
> may not have this in their budgets.

They can eat out just fine in *Argentina*!

> the number of international entries is quite small

Why? And does the TDC like it that way? I would hope not...

And actually, last year 43% were from overseas*, although
for some reason only 29% of the winners were... The thing
to look at is *where* overseas. Germans are just as rich as
Americans. Of the 15 countries participating, at *most* 3
can be considered non-affluent. Another thing to note is
that only one is a non-Latin country, and last year there
were no non-Latin winners at all... Finally, look at the
overall number of submissions over the past three years,
and compare those to Morisawa's. To me te TDC seems to
be doing something very wrong. What is it, I wonder?...


> one must get clear on what you expect from contests

Agreed. I personally expect:
1. The marketing and promotion to be truthful.
2. The merit of the results come before shmoozing.


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