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OLD-IRISH-L  June 2002

OLD-IRISH-L June 2002

Subject:

Re: Tech Midcuarta - god line

From:

Richard Marsh <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Scholars and students of Old Irish <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Fri, 14 Jun 2002 12:50:36 +0100

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (107 lines)

> As I said, what besides the etymology of her name would link her to
the mead
> hall?

The etymology is a link, not positive proof, but that and the fact that
"the name originally meant 'one who intoxicates'" should be enough to
enable most people's imagination to make that leap. Imagination,
especially in the interpretation of myth and legend, is much more
important than proof, though sciences such as archaeology and
linguistics can provide useful keys and springboards.

> >attributes that show her to be a sovereignty/mother/earth goddess
> Why should one assume that all three would be combined in a single
figure?

Because it's logical, at least in the logic of the subconscious, where
the imagination resides, and I think most folklorists would agree.

> I can see the links to sovereignty, though as far as I know your
> assumptions, such as the voice of Medbh being associated with the Lia
Fa/il,
> are not cited in the literature

"The literature", isn't everything. Modern historians are now coming
round to the realisation that local lore is often more likely to be
accurate than the writings of professional historians.

> that they though of a single "Mother Goddess" with aspects [snip]
sounds like a modern view of things

As Christians think of a single God with "aspects" (Catholic "persons")
of Father, Son and Holy Spirit? There is nothing wrong with a "modern
view" as long as it doesn't distort the true picture.

> It's an interesting idea, but I think other explanations are possible.

That's the wonderful thing about the interpretation of myth and legend:
much of what you see in them is what you bring to them.

Richard Marsh
----- Original Message -----
From: Francine Nicholson <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Friday, June 14, 2002 1:33 AM
Subject: Re: Tech Midcuarta - god line


> >From: Richard Marsh <[log in to unmask]>
>
> >"The name originally meant 'one who intoxicates' .... there is little
> >doubt but that Meadhbh of Tara and Meadhbh of Cruachain were one and
the
> >same personage" (Ó hÓgáin, Myth, Legend and Romance, 1991, "Meadhbh".
>
> As I said, what besides the etymology of her name would link her to
the mead
> hall?
>
> > > And what makes her a "local aspect of the Mother Goddess"?
> >
> >Medb Leth-derg "would not permit any king in Temair (Tara) without
his
> >having herself as wife" (Eugene O'Curry, MS Mat., p. 480), among
other
> >attributes that show her to be a sovereignty/mother/earth goddess,
>
> Why should one assume that all three would be combined in a single
figure?
>
> >for example her voice (from the earth) through the Lia Fáil approving
the
> >rightful king as her (the land's)consort, spreading her legs -- the
> >standing stones Bloc and Bluigne -- as the king drove his chariot
> >between them, the sile-na-gig on Bluigne, Rath Maeve 2 miles south of
> >Tara.
>
> I can see the links to sovereignty, though as far as I know your
> assumptions, such as the voice of Medbh being associated with the Lia
Fa/il,
> are not cited in the literature--but I questioned your association
with
> "local aspect of the Mother Goddess." That assumes two things: one,
that the
> pre-Christian Irish associated mother goddess with sovereignty, and
two,
> that they though of a single "Mother Goddess" with aspects. The frist
may be
> possible, but the second sounds like a modern view of things.
>
> > > Did Mr. Warner offer any evidence for this notion of a "god line"
> >being other than his own speculation?
> >
> >Nothing as solid as a god-faxed map. He mentioned some references to
> >archetypal charioteers driving cross-country in a straight line --
which if
> >you're familiar with Irish roads you know is physically impossible --
but I
> >don't remember specific references.
>
> It's an interesting idea, but I think other explanations are possible.
>
> Francine Nicholson
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com
>

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