LISTSERV mailing list manager LISTSERV 16.5

Help for CELTIC-L Archives


CELTIC-L Archives

CELTIC-L Archives


CELTIC-L@LISTSERV.HEANET.IE


View:

Message:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Topic:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Author:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

Font:

Proportional Font

LISTSERV Archives

LISTSERV Archives

CELTIC-L Home

CELTIC-L Home

CELTIC-L  October 2001

CELTIC-L October 2001

Subject:

Re: goos and gods

From:

Raimund Karl <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

CELTIC-L - The Celtic Culture List.

Date:

Tue, 16 Oct 2001 12:12:48 +0100

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (83 lines)

Dear JJ,

> From: CELTIC-L - The Celtic Culture List.
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]]On Behalf Of J J
<snipped>
> Maybe *leugh came from Lug and that's why it was (mistakenly) called
> the GOO.  See, I can theorize too, and I'm just an idiot.

While theorizing may be quite funny, it can hardly replace serious study and
is pointless without first possessing a certain amount of knowledge about
the existing facts - which you, as yet, seem not to have.
Celtic-l is not especially an academic list, but I would prefer if you would
be able to defend your statements by more than "common sense" (which, in
most cases, isn`t that common and most often makes no sense at all).
Let`s take a short look at some of your statements:

> But using my common-sense (I know you don't believe in it, :)), it
> seems that Lugu is a Sun-god, a god of light (leuk), because there
> are so many Lugdunums, founded for important gods obviously.

A) It is not even clear if the Lugdunums are named after Lugus at all. Read
Maier`s article in Ériu 47, 1996 "Is Lug to be Identified with Mercury?"
p.127-135.
B) Even if it were a fact that these Lugdunums were all named after Lugus,
that still doesn`t indicate that he is a sun-god. There is no direct link
between important god and sun-god.
C) Even if these places were named after Lugus, this doesn`t necessarily
tell us that he was an important god, only that he was a god which seemingly
had a certain connection to certain places. As such, even if it were that
these places were named after him, it could well be that they were named
after him because he was a minor spirit that protected houses from catching
fire. Naming a place where many wooded structures stand after a spirit that
protects from wood catching fire seems like a perfectly reasonable idea. Or
maybe these places were craft centers, and thus were named after the god of
all arts (which is something we even would have some evidence for).

Thus, your common sense already fails the first test of reason.

> But really!: let's name the Hill-fort after the <God of Oaths>... "I
> don't think so, Gefuntorix, let's dedicate it to the goddam shining
> Sun-god!!" (Cries of drunken agreement...)

Why not name it after the god of oath? Honour was a very important concept
in Celtic culture, and being caught lying or breaking ones oath meant
complete loss of social status - even for a king.  Thus, having a god of
oath, and naming places after him, makes perfect sense. So, why name a place
after a goddam shining sun-god who is mostly irrelvant to society, when you
can name your city after the god which stands for honour and the keeping of
oaths?

Yet again, your commonm sense fails the most simple of tests.

> Point 2:  I don't think the Keltoi had a <god of oaths>.  You've read
> the Punic Wars, right? (Did I mean the Gallic wars?)

Now, what do you mean? The Punic wars or the Gaulish wars? And what has this
to do with the matter in question at all?

> Is there really evidence for a GOO?  Is seems to me (I'm havin' a
> common sense attack again!), that people (now and forver) swear on
> the highest power lyin' about, God or Jesus or the Devil ...  Or
> Lugu.

Well, there is quite some evidence for an Oath god, whatever your common
sense might tell you. Seemingly, people did not, now and forever, swear on
the highest power they could - at least not, if there was a specific one
that watched over oaths.

Sorry about that, but your common sense attacks seem not to work,

all the best anyways,

RAY
____________________________________________

Raimund Karl <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
Research Fellow for European Archaeology
Centre for Advanced Welsh and Celtic Studies
National Library of Wales
Aberystwyth, Ceredigion, Cymru, UK
SY23 3HH
____________________________________________

Top of Message | Previous Page | Permalink

Advanced Options


Options

Log In

Log In

Get Password

Get Password


Search Archives

Search Archives


Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Subscribe or Unsubscribe


Archives

January 2019
December 2018
September 2018
March 2018
January 2018
December 2017
March 2017
February 2017
January 2017
November 2016
August 2016
May 2016
April 2016
March 2016
February 2016
January 2016
December 2015
November 2015
October 2015
September 2015
July 2015
June 2015
May 2015
March 2015
February 2015
December 2014
November 2014
October 2014
August 2014
June 2014
May 2014
February 2014
October 2013
September 2013
August 2013
July 2013
June 2013
May 2013
April 2013
March 2013
January 2013
December 2012
November 2012
October 2012
September 2012
August 2012
July 2012
June 2012
May 2012
April 2012
March 2012
February 2012
January 2012
December 2011
November 2011
October 2011
September 2011
August 2011
July 2011
June 2011
May 2011
April 2011
March 2011
February 2011
January 2011
December 2010
November 2010
October 2010
September 2010
August 2010
July 2010
June 2010
May 2010
March 2010
February 2010
January 2010
December 2009
November 2009
October 2009
September 2009
August 2009
July 2009
June 2009
May 2009
April 2009
March 2009
February 2009
January 2009
December 2008
November 2008
October 2008
September 2008
August 2008
July 2008
June 2008
May 2008
April 2008
March 2008
February 2008
January 2008
December 2007
November 2007
October 2007
September 2007
August 2007
July 2007
June 2007
May 2007
April 2007
March 2007
February 2007
January 2007
December 2006
November 2006
October 2006
September 2006
August 2006
July 2006
June 2006
May 2006
April 2006
March 2006
February 2006
January 2006
December 2005
November 2005
October 2005
September 2005
August 2005
July 2005
June 2005
May 2005
April 2005
March 2005
February 2005
January 2005
December 2004
November 2004
October 2004
September 2004
August 2004
July 2004
June 2004
May 2004
April 2004
March 2004
February 2004
January 2004
December 2003
November 2003
October 2003
September 2003
August 2003
July 2003
June 2003
May 2003
April 2003
March 2003
February 2003
January 2003
December 2002
November 2002
October 2002
September 2002
August 2002
July 2002
June 2002
May 2002
April 2002
March 2002
February 2002
January 2002
December 2001
November 2001
October 2001
September 2001
August 2001
July 2001
June 2001
May 2001
April 2001
March 2001
February 2001
January 2001
December 2000
November 2000
October 2000
September 2000
August 2000
July 2000
June 2000
May 2000
April 2000
March 2000
February 2000
January 2000
December 1999
November 1999
October 1999
September 1999
August 1999
July 1999
June 1999
May 1999
April 1999
March 1999
February 1999
January 1999
December 1998
November 1998
October 1998
September 1998
August 1998
July 1998
June 1998
May 1998
April 1998
March 1998
February 1998
January 1998
December 1997
November 1997
October 1997
September 1997
August 1997
July 1997
June 1997
May 1997
April 1997
March 1997
February 1997
January 1997
December 1996
November 1996
October 1996
September 1996
August 1996
July 1996
June 1996
May 1996
April 1996
March 1996
February 1996
January 1996
December 1995
November 1995
October 1995
September 1995
August 1995
July 1995
June 1995
May 1995
April 1995
March 1995
February 1995
January 1995
December 1994
November 1994
October 1994
September 1994
August 1994
July 1994
June 1994
May 1994
April 1994
March 1994
February 1994
January 1994
December 1993
November 1993
October 1993
September 1993
August 1993
July 1993
June 1993
May 1993
April 1993
March 1993
February 1993
January 1993
December 1992
November 1992
October 1992
September 1992
August 1992
July 1992
June 1992
May 1992
April 1992
March 1992
February 1992
January 1992
December 1991
November 1991
October 1991
September 1991
August 1991
July 1991
June 1991
May 1991

ATOM RSS1 RSS2



LISTSERV.HEANET.IE

Secured by F-Secure Anti-Virus CataList Email List Search Powered by the LISTSERV Email List Manager